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I don’t mean to be negative or unkind, but the playing on all of the recordings from diminished players sounds like a struggle. I don’t hear the effortless flow that is touted from this supposedly simpler layout. I’d definitely consider trying diminished tuning based on the potential advantages, but I don’t hear it in the playing as yet. If there are some impressive recordings or videos that show off diminished tuning, please post them.
Quote from: Doug on April 30, 2021, 03:29:29 PMI don’t mean to be negative or unkind, but the playing on all of the recordings from diminished players sounds like a struggle. I don’t hear the effortless flow that is touted from this supposedly simpler layout. I’d definitely consider trying diminished tuning based on the potential advantages, but I don’t hear it in the playing as yet. If there are some impressive recordings or videos that show off diminished tuning, please post them.You really have a way with words, Doug
well put Jason,. Not sure I would claim that anything worthwhile is effortless. Doesn't take much effort to be a turd though.. sometimes they just flow 😬
Now don’t go twisting my words. I never claimed that anything worthwhile is (or should be) effortless. I exaggerated when I said effortless flow is touted by dimi players, but diminished tuning has been discussed here before and it’s always described as intuitive, which I believe means it’s easier to master than standard tuning. One of you dimi evangelists said you’re on a mission to convert everyone to dimi. Why? Because you think it’s that much better.Sorry to ruffle your feathers. I’m open to dimi tuning, but I’m just not convinced yet.
For those of you who haven’t tried it, the note pattern is the same as you are used to on holes 1 and 3–four notes, blow, blow button, draw, draw button. So it will make sense to you right away. And the draw button note is the same as the blow note on the next hole. Is there a tutorial online?
Quote from: Gnarly He Man on May 02, 2021, 12:08:16 AMFor those of you who haven’t tried it, the note pattern is the same as you are used to on holes 1 and 3–four notes, blow, blow button, draw, draw button. So it will make sense to you right away. And the draw button note is the same as the blow note on the next hole. Is there a tutorial online? Angelfire.com was the best resource I found when looking in to it. Was never able to find any video tutorials. EZ
Doug,Thank you so much for taking the time to listen to my music! To be honest, I'm not always sure some harmonica players even get what I'm trying to do. But I know most of the really good ones do, even if they see my faults along with the good. You know - this is true - I have never taken a lesson on chromatic harmonica, and just a few on blues harp a long time ago. I've always somewhat regretted that. I seriously discussed lessons with someone on the west coast (USA) for a while, but it never materialized because of the geographical distance. I'm sorry that didn't happen at the time. Life is busier now, with a more demanding day job, family life, and writing some instructional books in my spare time. You know how it is. I wonder if I'll ever have the time at this point.Since you are here and already evaluating, do you think you could give me some tips? I am open to any constructive criticism. I wouldn't expect that you've listened to everything on my website, but just the first track. Here's the link from soundcloud: https://soundcloud.com/jasonharmonica/home. It's embedded in my website at https://jasonharmonica.com/. Thank you so much!--Jason
I am here working on Matt Watson‘s CX 12s—he gave me two to work on.One is half valved, and the other is fully valved.Half valving is great on diminished, since there is a whole step between each pair of draw notes. And I always have fun trying to play this tuning, but as has been fully documented, I’m sticking with bebop.
Quote from: Gnarly He Man on May 02, 2021, 07:19:47 PMI am here working on Matt Watson‘s CX 12s—he gave me two to work on.One is half valved, and the other is fully valved.Half valving is great on diminished, since there is a whole step between each pair of draw notes. And I always have fun trying to play this tuning, but as has been fully documented, I’m sticking with bebop.I’m curious why the CX12 seems to be so popular for diminished tuning.
Hey EZ,I played a normal 270 for a little while at first, but I was more just fooling around with it. Then when I got more serious I played a bebop tuning for about six months. After that, I went with Dimi, kind of bouncing around between half-valved and fully valved.I spent a lot of time with a Hering chrom (Charlie Musselwhite model) which I had tuned to Dimi myself. It was air-tight, bent great and had a fast slide. I may have heard about it from Joe Leone on this site; I know he liked them. A little bright, tone-wise, but I loved it. I think I made a construction paper gasket for the mouthpiece at one point. That was my main chrom until some time later I had a CX-12 which Pat Missin had tuned and customized for me. I also had one or more chroms tuned to Dimi by our own Gnarly from this thread. I have one that I always return to. I come from a piano and trombone background. I tend to think in note names, so I don't play by scale numbers or by patterns. But anyway, it's still a great advantage to be able to play in all keys.I haven't tried the PowerChrom but it seems to me to be similar to Dimi except that you'd specialize in primary keys, where Dimi traverses all keys. It has four enharmonics if I recall and of course, all holes are suitable for half-valving.
I haven't tried the PowerChrom but it seems to me to be similar to Dimi except that you'd specialize in primary keys, where Dimi traverses all keys.
funny I too am a slide man,. Bass trombone that is.
Quote from: Doug on April 30, 2021, 03:29:29 PMI don’t mean to be negative or unkind, but the playing on all of the recordings from diminished players sounds like a struggle. I don’t hear the effortless flow that is touted from this supposedly simpler layout. I’d definitely consider trying diminished tuning based on the potential advantages, but I don’t hear it in the playing as yet. If there are some impressive recordings or videos that show off diminished tuning, please post them.I am surprised to see all the responses here. I will try to answer your criticism from my own limited experience. I feel like it is more intuitive in the same way a guitar is. There is a predictable pattern. It doesn't make it smooth or effortless, but it makes more sense. I will show some examples.1. With three repeating patterns it's difficult to know where I am. I will always know where I am on a solo because the pattern changes a lot. On Dimi it's like playing a solo on guitar with no open strings and eyes closed. I have to know where the notes are or I miss them. This is bad for flow, but I suspect it forces me to use my ears more. I need to listen if I am playing a G, because I can't just quickly see if there's a double C next to it. In the long run I suspect the flow will come.2. Some arpeggios use a lot of blow or draw notes. On solo some of the chords use a fluent mix of blow, draw, button in, button out. This unilateral sense of direction in Diminished make it easy to fall of the beat. On the other hand none of the arpeggios require large jumps, next note is almost always on the next hole. This is true for melodies too. I am learning Au Privave and on solo there are some big jumps, on Dimi they are much narrower. So far I miss the blends of colors in the chords on solo, but I welcome the ease of switching between keys without thinking too much. 3. It is a lot of button work, this probably make it more difficult to play fluently.These are three aspects about the Dimi that I am reflecting on so far. It is not all good, but I suspect it will improve. In the end I don't think it matters if you play solo or Dimi. If you put in the same amount of practice as Filip Jers, Toots Thiel man's or any of the other pros I really don't think it matters. Any layout will sound perfect. Myself I got very exhausted learning all the arpeggios and scales in 11 patterns, always dealing with the numerous Cs. Dimi allows me to play more keys faster, but it doesn't make me a better player. If anything I have taken 12 steps back.